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gamer guy
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 11:57 am Posts: 863 Location: I'm stuck somewhere... Not quite sure where that is though.
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How would Baton Passing to a Choice Scarfer work? Like using the Ninjask as a BPer and passing it to a Tyranitar with a Choice Scarf. (Those were both random Pokemon I chose.)
_________________ All I know is that I know nothing.
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Sat Dec 08, 2007 8:33 am |
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ShadowTyranitar
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 5:12 pm Posts: 214 Location: Realgam Tower
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Pretty much, but that was a weird example since Jask has Speed Boost but w/e.
Passing Atk would be more important, if a Poke is already packing Scarf, like Hera. (also a random example)
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Sat Dec 08, 2007 8:36 am |
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KOL40
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:41 pm Posts: 728 Location: Atlanta, on a never ending quest to find wifi opponents...
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Actually, no. Pass speed to a poke with specks/band. That way it will hit harder, and won't need the speed.
_________________Think you can handle the Shady Park Gym?1461*4103*1427 <center><img src="images/trainercards/kol40.png"></center>
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Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:35 am |
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MissingNo_Is_My_Friend
Ace Trainer
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:17 am Posts: 360 Location: Somewhere between Life and Afterlife
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So basically you want to have a Pokemon with essentially a scarf and specs/band?
Like Scizor using Swords Dance and BP to Choice Scarf Garchomp?
Or Togekiss using Nasty Plot and BP to a Choice Scarf Porygon-Z?
I think it's fairly common.
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Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:29 pm |
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sanjay120
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:43 pm Posts: 117
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It's a terrible idea. You are stuck in a move, they switch to a resist/immune, you have to switch out. BP to a Life Orb Pokemon, or something with Lum Berry.
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Sat Dec 08, 2007 2:55 pm |
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The Obsidian Wolf
Pokemon Master
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:03 am Posts: 1559 Location: Dragon's Den
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I think you're beter off using something like Ninjask to pass to a Banded Poke. That way, you're assured to get at least one speed boost in (with the help of of Focus Sash) and then pass to a banded poke. That way, you might even be able to pass some attack as well, (if you lead with SDance. )
And sanjay, to counter that problem, just use a move that won't be able to be wholly blocked; Stone Edge, for one, has absolutely no immunities, not even from Sheddy. If you go with EQ / Double Edge, then of course you're going to lose.
_________________"Play with fire and expect to be burned."
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Sun Dec 09, 2007 2:29 am |
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Frost
THE POWER IS ON!
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 3:29 am Posts: 1581 Location: Purple Ranger
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I still don't see how that's a good idea. Let's take your example attack, Stone Edge. You pass stats to something holding a Choice item and it uses Stone Edge. Once your opponent realizes you're locked into Stone Edge, he or she switches in a... I dunno, TANGROWTH. (Editor's note: for some reason I had a total blonde moment here and thought Grass resists Rock. Which is odd, because I usually have the type dis/advantages down pretty well.)
You're now stuck using Stone Edge against a bulky Physical tank who resists Rock attacks. Your options are now to switch or eat a big attack like Power Whip or Sleep Powder and cause little/no damage in return. Not to mention that Stone Edge has shaky PP (and accuracy) and you'll be stuck Struggling once all eight clips are gone.
And this is just based on Stone Edge. Name another attack and you can probably find at least one OU Pokemon who can substitute in for Tangrowth's role in my example.
Last edited by Frost on Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sun Dec 09, 2007 8:57 am |
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undertaker
Ace Trainer
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:15 pm Posts: 333 Location: The Darkest Corner of My Mind
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You're still going to get some resistance no matter what move you use, just use a poke that can counter multi-pokes and use a Choice item.
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Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:07 am |
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Frost
THE POWER IS ON!
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 3:29 am Posts: 1581 Location: Purple Ranger
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The point was that Baton Passing to a Pokemon holding a Choice item isn't a great strategy. You either have to switch out, thereby losing your stat boost, or get walled hard by whatever counter is brought in to take your Choice'd move.
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Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:18 am |
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FaceLess
Ace Trainer
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:59 pm Posts: 399
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Frost wrote: I still don't see how that's a good idea. Let's take your example attack, Stone Edge. You pass stats to something holding a Choice item and it uses Stone Edge. Once your opponent realizes you're locked into Stone Edge, he or she switches in a... I dunno, TANGROWTH.
You're now stuck using Stone Edge against a bulky Physical tank who resists Rock attacks. Your options are now to switch or eat a big attack like Power Whip or Sleep Powder and cause little/no damage in return. Not to mention that Stone Edge has shaky PP (and accuracy) and you'll be stuck Struggling once all eight clips are gone.
And this is just based on Stone Edge. Name another attack and you can probably find at least one OU Pokemon who can substitute in for Tangrowth's role in my example. Hippo would be a better example since, y'know grass takes neutral from rock.
That's the big point though, scarf pokemon are often forced to switch pretty easily. That's why I much prefer baton passing to a pokemon that knows baton pass. Especially with speed.
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Sun Dec 09, 2007 4:09 pm |
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gamer guy
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 11:57 am Posts: 863 Location: I'm stuck somewhere... Not quite sure where that is though.
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I wasn't planning on using this strategy. I was just wondering if it would work even a little.
_________________ All I know is that I know nothing.
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Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:11 am |
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KOL40
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:41 pm Posts: 728 Location: Atlanta, on a never ending quest to find wifi opponents...
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pass to a life orber...
_________________Think you can handle the Shady Park Gym?1461*4103*1427 <center><img src="images/trainercards/kol40.png"></center>
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Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:53 am |
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AKART
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 10:01 am Posts: 204 Location: Riding on Salamence, looking for Bidoof to kill
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After a good Baton-Pass from Ninjask, the best option is a Choice-Scarfed Pokemon with a no-immunity powerful move that has extreme attack. A perfect example would be Rampardos with Stone Edge. Stone Edge hits everything, and with an already immense attack plus three Swords Dances, you get a good shot. What's more, Ninjask also does well knowing Mind Reader. First you Swords Dance three times, then Mind Reader, then Baton-Pass, together with Speed Boost, and... PING!!! Rampardos with invincible attack, higher speed and a never-missing Stone Edge.
I hereby finish my speech.
_________________ I have absolutely no time on my hands, so if you're sending me a PM for whatever reason expect to receive a reply in a few years. Try to use my e-mail if you can.
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Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:14 am |
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sanjay120
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:43 pm Posts: 117
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Except Ninjask can't learn Mind Reader, you can't BP Mind Reader, Rampardos is fragile, and Hippo still walls it.
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Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:10 pm |
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Cuddles
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:23 pm Posts: 899
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and ninjask can never last 4 turns (3 x swords dance + 1 x mind reader).
the logic in the arguments against this idea are just the same as logic against using choice items. but people still do use them (myself included).
i think the main reason not to use this idea is that not only is the choice-scarfer locked into its attack (like it would be anyway), but there was also time and possibly a pokemon wasted in the setting up. eg, you pass a nasty plot to choice-scarf special sweeper, then they switch in blissey and just laugh at the damage. you have to switch out, and the poke who used nasty plot and baton pass has been damaged, and blissey gets a free hit at whoever comes out next.
_________________ everything you will ever need to know is in my sig.
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Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:22 pm |
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sanjay120
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:43 pm Posts: 117
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Cuddles, that is exactly it. With a normal Scarfer, you get in, hit, and get out. You don't waste time setting up because you have to switch out soon.
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Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:39 pm |
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gamer guy
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 11:57 am Posts: 863 Location: I'm stuck somewhere... Not quite sure where that is though.
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So, I am guessing that it is an overall bad idea.
_________________ All I know is that I know nothing.
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Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:13 pm |
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Bentendo1
Bug Catcher
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:02 pm Posts: 2 Location: I'm Southern California Trash :]
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Baton Passing to a Choice *insert band/specs/scarf here* is a bad idea. After a Baton Pass, the Pokemon is meant to sweep the entire team. If it's limited to one move, as a Choice item does, then it loses that versatility, so it will only be able to take out a few Pokemon, if any. The opponent can predict your move and switch into a great counter; there goes that.
It can work, but it's not very guaranteed to work.
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Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:23 pm |
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