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 Creative Movesets *Announcement over DP: see first post* 
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Lite Four
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I seem to have seen that set before, but then again it isn't in the Standard Movesets Guide. I'll have to wait for a second opinion on this one.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:08 am
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Maybe you could test this....

{roselia} @ Lefties | Poison Point | Impish nature
Synthesis/ Giga Drain/ Shadow BALL / HP Rock
252 SPA 252 ATK 6 HP

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:38 am
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Lite Four
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Maybe you could explain the purpose of your set? It looks like it's rather unfocused. Split EVs, Mixed Sweeping, no other alternative strategies...

While not standard, the set isn't creative either.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:52 am
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His roselia is sort of creative. If you change a few things so you have this:


{roselia} @ Lefties| Poison Point
Hasty/Naive nature
EVs 252 Spd, 157 Atk, 101 Sp Atk
Sludge Bomb
Giga Drain/Magical Leaf
Shadow BALL
HP Rock

Pretty much covers all of roselia's weaknesses. Shadow ball gets psychics. HP Rock gets fire, ice, and flying. Giga Drain/Magical Leaf gets the STAB. And Sludge Bomb takes care of other Grass types plus gets a STAB. More EVs to Attack because it's much lower than its Special Attack.

Not to do your job for you guys, but with a max speed of about 276 with the right nature, it doesn't have the speed to be a sweeper.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 6:32 am
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Not sure if this is creative or not but i'll let you decide that

{gengar} Gengar @Chesto
Ability: Levitate
Nature: Bold/Impish
Mean Look
Destiny Bond
Curse
Rest

Very basic idea, Start with Mean Look then use Curse. After that use rest and when you run out of PP on Rest and you have low health use Destiny Bond.


Fri Feb 10, 2006 1:17 pm
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It's perfectly fine to give suggestions to other sets that have been submitted. Either way, I see the Roselia similar to how snow does; split EVs with mixed sweeping and not really a creative idea. You might think of it as creative because it isn't used. The reason why it isn't used is because it wouldn't work very well. :roll:

On Gengar, the opponent can just switch to Sweeper or something before you use Mean Look and even if you manage to trap the right one, using Curse will make it so much easier for you to faint, and then they switch out of it. Rest would be another thing that would just leave you wide open after you use it, just not on the first time. I don't see it worth a test either.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 1:50 pm
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How about this guy for a phys sweeper.

{scyther}@Salac berry
Nature: Adament
Ability:Swarm
EVs 252 att, 252 spd, 6 hp
Endure
Reversal
Sword Dance
HP Bug/HP Flying/Quick attack

Basic reverser. I've just never seen anyone do it with scyther and I think he'd do well against someone who wants to use a rock type attack.

or....


{scyther}@Leftovers/Lum berry
Nature: Adament
Ability:Swarm
EVs 252 att, 252 spd, 6 hp
Sword Dance/Aerial Ace
HP Rock
Silver Wind
Steel Wing

Basic physical sweeper stuff

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:49 pm
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Lite Four
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I have seen the first set quite a number of times back when I still had NetBattle. As for the second set, it's a common moveset, but most people evolve Scyther into Scizor. I'll wait for a second opinion on this as well, just to be fair.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 6:19 pm
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I've got another Idea...

Primeape@Leftovers/Scope Lens
Adamant
EV's 252 Attack, 252 speed, 6 HP
Beat Up
Rock Slide
Focus Energy
Cross Chop

Rock Slide Covers Flying, Beat Up covers Psychic. Primape's SA is not good but if you have other pokemon who are I think its worth it. Cross Chop + Focus Energy + scope lens = Critical Hit. Not sure about creativity. BTW, still waiting for the 2nd opinion on my snorlax (page 54)


Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:00 pm
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Lite Four
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A "no" for the Primeape. There's already a similar set in the Hall of Fame.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:10 pm
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sN0wBaLL wrote:
As for the second set, it's a common moveset, but most people evolve Scyther into Scizor. I'll wait for a second opinion on this as well, just to be fair.

The reason I made the second one is that most of the time you see scizor. Scyther is faster though, so it may work out better.

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Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:13 pm
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sN0wBaLL wrote:
A "no" for the Primeape. There's already a similar set in the Hall of Fame.


Oops Sorry... :oops:


Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:17 pm
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Either way on the Scythers, I wouldn't count something that's unevolved without a unique strategy for the evolved form as being creative.

Sorry I missed the Snorlax; anyway, it's going to useless against a lot of things. Double Team will take a while to get up effectively, especially if Attract doesn't work. It would be best to use Rest if it's protected Attract and Double Team, otherwise you're open. It's Speed will still be really bad, so there won't be any need for Headbutt, so that would change to Return. If you get Attract up, they can switch out of it to a more effective Pokemon. This would force you to switch out of Double Team, too. Toxic would also be a reason for your opponent to switch out, and Rest should be prefered over it anyway. There is definitely a lot that can go wrong with this, but I could give it a brief go and see how it works.

I'll probably get to testing these within a day or so.



Update:

Alright, some results: (Finally, took longer than I thought) :roll:

Gardevoir: Just didn't work. It just couldn't even survive to work effectively. It can't do anything except Facade, and that is hard enough to get set up, not to mention weakening yourself while doing it.

Snorlax: Also couldn't get around to working much. Like I said, there was just too much that could stop it and that could easily put an end to it.

Steelix: As I remarked, Rest would be too slow without Quick Claw, and Sleep Talk would be a risk to it. It worked rarely and it just isn't good enough.

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Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:04 am
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Alright then, two more I've come up with:

{typhlosion} @ Leftovers
Ability: Blaze
Nature: Serious (=)
EVs: 252 Att., 156 Def, 96 Sp. Def., 6 Sp. Att.
~Crush Claw
~Fire Blast
~Earthquake
~HP Grass

Mixed Sweeper. The Ev's make his Attack a tiny bit higher than his Sp. Attack, but that's okay. The Defenses are equaled out by this distribution, and the last 6 go into Sp. Attack. So, just about even on both defenses and both attacks. Use Crush Claw to lower Defense and hurt as much as possible. Use HP Grass against your weaknesses, EQ for general high powered physical attack, and Fire Blast for STAB if you get the chance. And I ran the numbers, and Fire Blast's Effective Strength (Power x Accuracy) is 102, higher than Flamethrower.

{steelix} @ Quick Claw
Ability: Sturdy
Nature: Jolly (+Spd., -Sp. Att.)
EVs: 252 Def., 252 HP, 6 Spd.
~Taunt
~Double Team
~Rage
~Iron Tail

Phsyical Wall. I'm convinced there's something creative you can do with Steelix, so this is another try. Best used against a physical sweeper (duh) or a Baton Pass-er. Taunt, then use Rage, then Double team when your Attack is high enough. Then use STABed Iron Tail, which nobody is immune to, so you can't just sit there and do nothing against them.

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Fri Feb 17, 2006 2:30 pm
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Typhlosion isn't creative. It's just all-out attack, no real strategy to it.

Steelix is just going to go out like the rest of the others, or quicker with Taunt. If you leave it in that is. Double Team would take long enough to get up even after Rage gets up. You have no protection and will usually have to switch out if the opponent switches. It's borderline, but I might as well test it. I also looked through Steelix's learnset, and there's not really much to do with it. You could go with a Sandstorm, Sand Tomb/Block, Toxic, Protect/Rock Slide/Iron Tail set or something, but I can't really think of much else than that could be creative.

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Fri Feb 17, 2006 3:48 pm
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I've got a weird idea =P

{qwilfish} @ Leftovers | Poison Point | Quiet Nature
EVs: 252 Atk, 129 Def 129 Sp Def
Revenge - Shadow Ball - Swords Dance - Flail???

I'm not sure about the last two moves. Strategy is to make use of Revenge's property: power is doubled when you're damaged before you attack. Quiet Nature lowers Qwilfish's Speed, so hopefully you'll receive a hit before you attack. EVs in defenses so it can last longer. I'm not sure how effective this would be though.

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:03 am
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Maybe a Mew like this:

Mew @ Leftovers/Synchronize/Adamant
>Rock Slide
>Softboiled
>Earthquake/Shadow Ball
>Trick

Rock Slide:Nothing is immune to it (& kills Shedinja)
Earthquake:da famous attack that can't hit 2 things: Levitate & Flying
Shadow Ball: Flygons

Choice Band boosts one of your attacks, if a Calm Minder pops up with Leftovers, Trick them and get your Leftovers, and attack like the world ends in one hour

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:20 am
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In the way that you say it, Mew starts out with Choice Band attached. The only way you can get it off is by using Trick the first turn, otherwise you're stuck with the other attack and not Trick. It's not like it's creative either, as Mew can learn any TM or Tutored Move, so it can be a simple sweeper. It also has a 100 base stat for each, and that wouldn't normally be overlooked. I don't think it cuts out as a creative strategy.

Qwilfish looks good though. There are a few things I'd change though. As its strategy does require less speed, it would definitely need more in the defense. I'd also add Sludge Bomb for STAB instead of Flail. So the new set would be:

{qwilfish} @ Leftovers
Sassy / Poison Point
EVs: 252 Spec. Def; 129 Def; 129 HP
- Revenge
- Shadow Ball
- Swords Dance
- Sludge Bomb

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:39 pm
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How bout this

{dragonite} @ Leftovers|
Serene Grace|
Modest Nature(Atk.-, Spc. Atk.+)

~Thunder
~Thunderbolt

~Rain Dance
~Surf

Ev's still don't get what they mean, but high Speacial Atk. and Defence.

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:59 pm
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{steelix} @ Quick Claw
Ability: Sturdy
Nature: Jolly (+Spd., -Sp. Att.)
EVs: 252 Sp. Def., 252 HP, 6 Spd.
~Block
~Toxic
~Sandstorm
~Protect

Man. As much as I like him, I guess Steelix pretty much just sucks.
Block, and pray that it traps somebody that won't kill you in one move. Toxic then Sandstorm for as much indirect damage as possible. Protect twice in a row, and if they both succeed, do a different move. If the second misses, then it resets and you start protecting again.

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:14 pm
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Lite Four
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The Dragonite is a straightforward Special Sweeping set. Though the standard is a Physical Sweeping one, this doesn't make your set any more creative. Anyway, if you haven't already, you might want to read the site's EV Guide to help you understand what EVs are. Here's the link: http://psypokes.com/lab/evguide.php

As for the Steelix... Well, I admire your determination in trying to get Steelix into the HoF, but some Pokemon just don't have the movepool to support alternative strategies. Furthermore, I think we've definitely seen such a set before, and I don't think it worked well, but I suppose it's worth another test :wink:

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Sat Feb 18, 2006 6:18 pm
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Results:

I expected that Qwilfish wouldn't be able to survive long at all, and I was right. It just doesn't have the defenses or time to do this very well, but it did work if it got going, it was just really open for all attacks. Good strategy, but it has a lot of downfalls. It's really on the borderline, but all those bad sides to it are just pulling it down. :? Thunder Wave would help, but it would also ruin the Revenge strategy. :P

Steelix is also a no, but I did change it around enough so that it could get in. The opponent will just switch in to something that can get you before you even get Block up. I also switched Block for Sand Tomb, and it worked a little better with the extra damage done. I had an idea around wearing down the foe, but not by much. Good annoyer. :P It has a fair amount to look out for, but this should suit the HoF well. So the set:

{steelix} @ Leftovers
Careful / Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP; 252 Spec. Def; 6 Attack
- Torment
- Sandstorm
- Sand Tomb
- Protect

Torment the incoming Special Sweeper and use Protect on their first move. They'll usually stay in, although they probably won't have another super-effective attack against you. Next use Sand Tomb, then Protect, Sandstorm, Protect, Sand Tomb, and keep alternating those and replenishing Sandstorm when necessary. Once Sand Tomb wears off, they might switch or stay in for more. Eventually, you might have to switch, but the maxed Special Defense and HP helps with living longer.

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Sun Feb 19, 2006 7:11 pm
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I think you double-posted instead of modifying :P . Oops. Stupid things that kept popping up saying "Not responding". =x

Also, IMO creative movesets for steelix are best left for double battles as steelix would either need its partner to use Follow Me or a trapping move while steelix does its role at the same time.

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Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:04 pm
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Finally, a Steelix set in the Hall of Fame. Congratulations then, JsXtm :D

As for the Qwilfish, I'll assume it isn't good enough for the time being. Since you say it's really on the borderline, would any further tweaking and/or testing help you to make a decision?

Edit: New idea of mine.

{miltank} @ Salac Berry
Reversal - Substitute - Shadow Ball - Thunder Wave
EVs: 252 Spd 252 Atk 6 HP

Not sure about the EV Spread. Anyway, the idea isn't new, but I don't think it's common for Miltank. Miltank has decent Speed (above 300; 328 iirc). After some subs, Salac should activate, and raise its Speed further, before using Reversal. Shadow Ball is just in case the foe is resistant to Reversal, and Thunder Wave is there to annoy, and to further lower the foe's Speed.

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Mon Feb 20, 2006 4:31 am
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I'm sorry if this has already been posted, but here goes...
{gardevoir} @ Focus Band
EVs: 252 Speed, 252 Special Attack, and 6 HP
Psychic
Mean Look
Endure
Destiny Bond

Psychic is just there for damage.
The others - Use Mean Look on a Pokemon with a lot of ofensive moves that could KO Gardevoir, use Endure, (I added Focus Band just in case) then use Destiny Bond to bring the foe with Gardy.

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