Creative Movesets *Announcement over DP: see first post*
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Author:  Skytune [ Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:59 pm ]
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sNOwBaLL, on that Umbreon, what if the opponent's ability is OwnTempo? Or if they have a LumBerry? It would work excellently against a Sp. Sweeper like Alakazam, as it can't benifit from Swagger, or another Trapper; pokemon that can't/don't make use of their Attack stat. I like it, but it may not work.

RL, I would go with Careful, (+ Sp. Def, - Sp. Att.) as Milotic's weaknesses are both Special. My question would be, what if it comes up against a Steel type, like Magneton? It'd resist Wrap pretty well, Toxic would be ineffective, and ConfuseRay wouldn't work very well. What if the Milotic got paralyzed? I like it, and it definatly is creative, but I'm not certain how well it'd work. I'd test it myself, but I'm at home over the weekend, and don't have NetBattle here.

Author:  tiger10x [ Sun Dec 11, 2005 3:57 pm ]
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On Milotic, I've actually seen a few variations of that on NetBattle myself. It should still be creative enough, though it's only a change of a move or two. I could test it myself along with Umbreon, if you don't object, Skytune. (Almost done testing Umbreon anyway)

When it comes down to "If it goes up against..." it's more or less if it has a LOT that it won't work against, then no, but if it doesn't have much to look after, then it's okay just to switch out the test Pokemon. After all, you can still test it on switch-ins and other stuff later on the same battle.

No comment on Sparce, though? :P

Edit: (Umbreon results)

Did okay... with some major difficulties. Practically just what I said, along with Skytune's remarks. Just didn't do well enough. Sorry.

Author:  Skytune [ Sun Dec 11, 2005 4:46 pm ]
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On the Sparce, can it learn Thunderbolt or Psychic? I would replace Thunderwave with Thunderbolt. With SereneGrace, it would still be quite likely to paralyze the foe, and Psychic would make the other attacks more effective with lowered Sp. Defence. Thanks for the hints on testing. Has anyone posted sNOwBaLL's SereneGrace Blissey? On the Milotic, be my guest. It's not fair to make RL wait for the weekend to get over just so I can test one of many pokemon. :)

Author:  tiger10x [ Sun Dec 11, 2005 5:57 pm ]
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The reason of T-Wave instead of T-Bolt is because even with Serene Grace, that's just a 20% chance. I'd prefer the 100% chance. Also why not Psychic, because it's supposed to still have the Paralyze, Confuse, Flinch strategy. You can't have 6 moves on it, but I would if I could. :P

Milotic results will be edited in later or posted tomorrow.

Author:  sN0wBaLL [ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:54 pm ]
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Skytune: I've posted the Serene Grace Blissey myself, but it was deemed rather standard and too similar to the Togetic set already in the Hall of Fame.

Anyway, go ahead and test the Sparce as well as the Milotic; I like both movesets :D

Pokemon to be tested: Slowbro, Sparce, and the Milotic, am I right?

Author:  Neo_Matrix [ Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:42 am ]
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Jacko cracko, this set looks good:

{blissey}- Blissey @ Leftovers
Modest Nature/252 Sp. Attack/129 Sp. Defense/129 HP
Serene Grace
~Rain Dance
~Water Pulse

Set up ThunderDance, sweep with double effects(Serene Grace). Heal when neccesary. Own like hell.

Author:  Skytune [ Mon Dec 12, 2005 11:33 am ]
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Tiger, on your Slowbro, it worked occasionally. It was a good staller, but couldn't last to counter common anti-psychic moves like Megahorn and ShadowBall. On the occasions where it surprised the opponent with Counter, it worked really well. However, without a Chesto Berry, Rest hurt you more than healed you. Sorry. :(

Author:  tiger10x [ Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:26 pm ]
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On Blissey: Not too creative except for Rain Dance. MURDERED by Physical attacks anyway. I believe that's around 50 Defense. Snow said that he posted Serene Grace Blissey earlier anyway and that was said too standard. I don't see how that's better.

We also forgot the Feraligatr, so I'll test that along with Milotic. I'll edit results in later.

Author:  RaichuLatias [ Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:44 pm ]
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With the Milotic: It doesn't work well against, Magneton, nor Gengar (Immune to Wrap and Toxic). I'd say just switch if one of those comes out. Marvel Scale also ups Defense when it is paralyzed (I think, i've never used it though), so if it Did get paralyzed, it'd probably make it harder to take down with a Physical Sweeper (I doubt many People would try Special Sweeping to knock it out since it has like 383 Max Special Defense with Nature boost, While it has like 250 w/o nature boost).

Though any Pokemon with Own Tempo also ruins it, since it needs Confuse Ray to help protect itself from T-Bolts and Giga Drains.

Author:  Cless [ Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:58 am ]
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Marvel Scale activates when Milotic has a random status effect, not just paralyzed.

Author:  tiger10x [ Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:57 pm ]
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Milotic earns a 5. Works like most Milotics with Toxic strategies. Owned two teams in a row... pretty funny really. :roll: Milotic isn't the type of Pokemon to die suddenly even by critical hits and super effective hits. It can easily still survive a Paralyze effect or a few Thunderbolts.

Feraligatr's kind of close. People just switch to faster counters to Feraligatr, which isn't too hard to counter. It's not too great.

Author:  sN0wBaLL [ Tue Dec 13, 2005 6:39 pm ]
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Excellent, the Milotic has been added to the Hall of Fame. I don't think RL needs the Psybucks, but if he wants me to anyway I can do it :D

Congratulations :D

Author:  Neo_Matrix [ Wed Dec 14, 2005 9:40 am ]
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tiger10x wrote:
On Blissey: Not too creative except for Rain Dance. MURDERED by Physical attacks anyway. I believe that's around 50 Defense. Snow said that he posted Serene Grace Blissey earlier anyway and that was said too standard. I don't see how that's better.

You have GOT to be kidding me. Murdered by Physical Attacks? It's ALWAYS been frickin' murdered by Physical Attacks. That Serene Grace Blissey had like, no defensive moves. It was just plain SWEEP.

This set takes advantage of THUNDER. ThunderDancing rocks when used correctly.

Author:  Prophet [ Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:07 pm ]
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But Neo he used the fact that it dies to physical attacks as a reason for the set not being effective. Nothing that has such a low defense (be it physical or special) and should EVER be used as a sweeper. Blissey's attack, defense, and speed make it too slow to set something like ThunderDance up. The one turn delay is too much. Like so:

Blissey used Rain Dance!
Opponent withdrew Starmie!
Opponent sent out Tauros!
Prophet withdrew Blissey!

And all you did was make it rain.

Blissey Special Attack is too low anyway.

Author:  tiger10x [ Wed Dec 14, 2005 4:31 pm ]
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With maxed out Defenses on Blissey, it can actually survive a heavy Physical hit and still be able to Softboiled back up. Blissey doesn't have perfect speed either. Yours has no Defense or Speed boost whatsoever. Prophet basically explained the rest.

Author:  Neo_Matrix [ Thu Dec 15, 2005 9:46 am ]
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Ok, howz about this:

{blissey}- Blissey @ Leftovers
Modest Nature/252 Sp. Attack/252 Defense/6 Speed
Serene Grace
~Rain Dance
~Water Pulse

Slight EV change, but combined with a Speed Boost it can do some MAJOR damage.

Author:  Cless [ Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:26 am ]
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A set taking advantage of Serene Grace isn't original and doesn't work either.
Just use Blissey as a special tank/staller.

Author:  Rhapsody [ Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:48 am ]
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I saw this in the Battle Factory, and it worked pretty well...
{golem} @Chesto Berry
Adamant/Sturdy/Evs: 252 Atk 252 D 6HP (someone can fix the EVS if they wish)
Focus Punch
Double Team
Sub-Punch after a few DT's, Rest when nesecary.


Author:  tiger10x [ Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:32 am ]
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I still side on not testing it. I still think that adding Rain Dance to it isn't that creative for a Serene Grace Blissey. It narrows down your choices more and powers you up a little. Besides that, most anything that can Sunny Day can stop it. Even though it has better defense, it still won't be able to live long or work well with that set. I seriously don't feel like commenting further, because I've already reviewed this and other people have too. :roll:

The way I see it, Golem will usually get one Sub down as the opponent switches to a Special Sweeper (if it's not already out). Then you get to attack once with Focus Punch and run or die. Or they go to a Ghost and you're useless. Rest will make you much more vulnerable, too. You can't count on Double Team to work that well. Besides that, I've seen Sub-Punch Golems before, although they aren't too common. Sorry.

Author:  ace18 [ Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:39 am ]
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{banette} @ leftovers

Author:  tiger10x [ Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:27 pm ]
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Your "tank killer" set isn't very original; Banette has been used quite often to that type of set. Sorry.

Author:  mr.m.m.j. [ Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:32 am ]
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Don't go "zomg u phail" at this Sceppy set because he has quite the decent Atack stat.

{sceptile} @ Leichi Berry
Nature:Adamant (+ Atack,- Special Atack)
EVs:252 Atack,129 Speed,129 Hp
~Crush Claw
~Rock Tomb / Hp (Rock)

Crush Claw is nice because it has a 50% chance of lowering the opponent's Defense.Rock Tomb or if you like more accuracy Hp (Rock) for Fire,Bug,Flying and Ice types (covers plenty weaknesses).Quake is for Poison types.Sub is there to take advantage of Leichi Berry (Atack berry if I'm not mistaken).EVs are in Atack (for damage),Speed (this thing is fast enough and can spare some Speed EVs) and Hp (to help its survivability).
An atackative Sceptile.If you think it's worth rating don't pit it against a Heracross or someting that will totaly own it.You can alternatively replace a move with Aerial Ace to help in handling Heracross.I hope this does well.Definately something a human opponent won't expect.

Author:  hfxjus [ Mon Dec 19, 2005 5:06 am ]
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How about a deadly {zangoose} ?

Zangoose@shell bell NATURE-Jolly
EVs: 252 Attack, 252 speed, 6 HP
1.Shadow Ball
4.Aerial Ace

Covers the only weakness of Zangoose with Aerial Ace against a fighting type
Can hit ghost type pokemon(s) with Shadow Ball. With Flamethrower, it can does a lot of damage against Grass, Bug and Steel types.

Author:  sN0wBaLL [ Mon Dec 19, 2005 6:36 am ]
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The Sceptile looks fine, but I'll wait for a second opinion.

The Zangoose doesn't make the mark though. Physical Sweeping is too standard for a Zangoose, and throwing Flamethrower is useless because with its low Special Attack further reduced by the Jolly Nature, it isn't going to be powerful enough.


Anyway, I'm trying to think of a moveset for an 00ber, Registeel.

{registeel} @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 Atk 129 Sp. Def 129 HP
Psych Up
HP Steel/Return

Registeel is usually used as for Curse-sweeping, I think. This would be slightly different, with Swagger and Psych Up. With its awesome Defense, it needs no defense against a Swaggered opponent. And once Psych Up is used, it can sweep pretty well already, without reduced Speed unlike with the use of Curse.

EVs I'm not so sure. I am wondering if I should place more EVs in Defense, just in case of a Swaggered Brick Break or something like that.

Not sure if it's creative enough though :/

Author:  Skytune [ Mon Dec 19, 2005 10:26 am ]
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I'll test the Sceptile, if it's alright with everyone else. If you don't like the defense on Registeel, try changing it to Regirock with the same set, maybe with RockSlide instead of HP/Return. That is, assuming Regirock and Registeel have the same or similar learnsets. Besides, the standard set for Registeel is a toxi-tank. I'll try it out too. Over and out. :)

EDIT: I'll try switching EVs on the Sceptile to max out speed; this thing can't take more than one hit. Also, I'll try replacing CrushClaw with AerialAce for more type advantages. On the Regirock/steel, many times the opponent strikes first or has a lum berry. :x I'll try the Steel tomorrow; the Rock did alright, but not quite there, methinks. I used a Claydol with a very similar set at the BattleFrontier, and it worked quite effectivly. *shrug* I'll report with results tomorrow.

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